Comments on: Tamp Down Recall Rage http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/ Sun, 12 Oct 2008 01:32:59 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5.1 By: sue harvey http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/#comment-389 sue harvey Thu, 18 Oct 2007 14:52:22 +0000 http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/#comment-389 I guess I have a view that we have problems in our state that are just the tip of an iceberg that our country is fast coming up on. World economics and global competition have first settled here like cancer but are spreading. These are new problems that call for leaders and think outside the box(partisan politics) stands. Those usually don't sit well. The recall and "no matter what, cut taxes" voices frighten me as I feel services that the state provide give us community (emphasise unity)and a future and I don't know how we can nurture "best and brightest" on the cheap.. I'm sad to see our state get so run down and shabby looking compared to other states, basics such as roads and public areas. So yes I think its about time for Michigan to look around and see that our state taxes are among the lowest per all US states.And is it just coincidence that some of the states with much higher taxes than MI also have more diverse and prosperous economy? I guess I have a view that we have problems in our state that are just the tip of an iceberg that our country is fast coming up on.
World economics and global competition have first settled here like cancer but are spreading. These are new problems that call for leaders and think outside the box(partisan politics) stands. Those usually don't sit well.
The recall and "no matter what, cut taxes" voices frighten me as I feel services that the state provide give us community (emphasise unity)and a future and I don't know how we can nurture "best and brightest" on the cheap..
I'm sad to see our state get so run down and shabby looking compared to other states, basics such as roads and public areas. So yes I think its about time for Michigan to look around and see that our state taxes are among the lowest per all US states.And is it just coincidence that some of the states with much higher taxes than MI also have more diverse and prosperous economy?

]]> By: Carolyn Brade http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/#comment-330 Carolyn Brade Mon, 15 Oct 2007 03:31:04 +0000 http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/#comment-330 I wonder if a politician is recalled before the last term if they still get free health care for life? If the recall prevents them from getting benefits for life, then in the long run the recall effort would be a big plus. Legislature should be on 401K not pension route. Very few people in the state hiring within the last 8 years in the private sector can retire with pensions from their employer, let alone get health care premiums paid by a prior employer. I wonder if a politician is recalled before the last term if they still get free health care for life? If the recall prevents them from getting benefits for life, then in the long run the recall effort would be a big plus. Legislature should be on 401K not pension route. Very few people in the state hiring within the last 8 years in the private sector can retire with pensions from their employer, let alone get health care premiums paid by a prior employer.

]]> By: Brian MacRae http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/#comment-329 Brian MacRae Mon, 15 Oct 2007 02:02:06 +0000 http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/#comment-329 Thanks to nolan Finley's column in the Free Press for making me aware of The Center for Michigan. You and he are right in noting that the status quo will never produce changes so badly needed in our state government. Right, too, in declaring that elected officials in our state government, whose responsibility it is to serve the real needs of our people, are criminally failing Michgan and its citizens. In fact, they have demonstrated an incredible lack of interest, let alone purpose, in fulfilling there responsibilities to the people. We are being held hostage by public officials whose sole concern is self interest, not the public's interest. By our personal lack of involvement in the issues, we ordinary citizens are also at fault. You're right! Together, we can fill Michigan's leadership void! Thanks to nolan Finley's column in the Free Press for making me aware of The Center for Michigan. You and he are right in noting that the status quo will never produce changes so badly needed in our state government. Right, too, in declaring that elected officials in our state government, whose responsibility it is to serve the real needs of our people, are criminally failing Michgan and its citizens. In fact, they have demonstrated an incredible lack of interest, let alone purpose, in fulfilling there responsibilities to the people. We are being held hostage by public officials whose sole concern is self interest, not the public's interest. By our personal lack of involvement in the issues, we ordinary citizens are also at fault.

You're right! Together, we can fill Michigan's leadership void!

]]> By: Mel Dodson http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/#comment-326 Mel Dodson Sun, 14 Oct 2007 23:05:48 +0000 http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/#comment-326 Recalls do work and we have to start at the "top". The only problem is; far to many people don't know and don't know they don't know!Now is the time for all good men and women to come to the aid of their state! Recalls do work and we have to start at the "top". The only problem is; far to many people don't know and don't know they don't know!Now is the time for all good men and women to come to the aid of their state!

]]> By: Julie Rutkowski http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/#comment-323 Julie Rutkowski Sun, 14 Oct 2007 20:40:02 +0000 http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/#comment-323 A recall serves as a means to communicate to politicians that they are accountable for their actions. Politicians are elected to lead and while leading may mean going against the will of the people, it also requires that these leaders go against the will of interest groups. In this budget debacle, politicians catered to the interest groups while thwarting the will of the people. Had politicians seriously considered cuts, I would have supported a slight increase. This however, was never the case. As such, in my opinion, a recall is necessary. Leon Drolet may not be the most noble of politicians but he is attempting to engage the citizenry: more than I can say for those currently in the state legislature. You offer little evidence for your claims that a recall will resolve nothing. I came to your site hoping to become more involved in the process of reforming MI, but your views are far from centrist, which leads me to doubt the credibility of your efforts. A recall serves as a means to communicate to politicians that they are accountable for their actions. Politicians are elected to lead and while leading may mean going against the will of the people, it also requires that these leaders go against the will of interest groups. In this budget debacle, politicians catered to the interest groups while thwarting the will of the people. Had politicians seriously considered cuts, I would have supported a slight increase. This however, was never the case. As such, in my opinion, a recall is necessary. Leon Drolet may not be the most noble of politicians but he is attempting to engage the citizenry: more than I can say for those currently in the state legislature. You offer little evidence for your claims that a recall will resolve nothing. I came to your site hoping to become more involved in the process of reforming MI, but your views are far from centrist, which leads me to doubt the credibility of your efforts.

]]> By: Ron Singer http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/#comment-317 Ron Singer Sun, 14 Oct 2007 12:46:14 +0000 http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/#comment-317 1. Recalls Solve Nothing. - I don't know how you can just say that without any evidence and without any willingness to even try it. Odd are about 50-50 that the replacement would be better than the legislator being replaced, but I think the odds are 100-0 that the replacement would be more responsible and more serious than the person he replaced. Perhaps the voters take these budget situations more seriously than the legislators. Without recalls, how should we let them know? 2. Recalls will only fuel partisan warfare. - I would suggest that you could make exactly the opposite case. That with virtually no threat of recall, legislators are free to follow the party dogma with no regard for the voters back home. 3. Loss of local control to fringe groups. - Here again, maybe a few recalls would return some control back to the local electorate. When these guys are running for office, they come through the neighborhoods with the same old story that goes something like this. "Tough decisions need to be made in Lansing, the people there now are not making those tough decisions, elect me because I am willing to make those tough decisions." Unfortunately, after they're elected, it seems that they no longer need or want to hear from the district, it seems that everything they need to know or do is determined in Lansing. If I don't like it, I can just wait 6 or 8 years and they'll be gone. The problem with this solution, is that they are replaced by someone who will be no different. Do you see a pattern here? We need to break the pattern. 1. Recalls Solve Nothing. - I don't know how you can just say that without any evidence and without any willingness to even try it. Odd are about 50-50 that the replacement would be better than the legislator being replaced, but I think the odds are 100-0 that the replacement would be more responsible and more serious than the person he replaced. Perhaps the voters take these budget situations more seriously than the legislators. Without recalls, how should we let them know?
2. Recalls will only fuel partisan warfare. - I would suggest that you could make exactly the opposite case. That with virtually no threat of recall, legislators are free to follow the party dogma with no regard for the voters back home.
3. Loss of local control to fringe groups. - Here again, maybe a few recalls would return some control back to the local electorate. When these guys are running for office, they come through the neighborhoods with the same old story that goes something like this. "Tough decisions need to be made in Lansing, the people there now are not making those tough decisions, elect me because I am willing to make those tough decisions." Unfortunately, after they're elected, it seems that they no longer need or want to hear from the district, it seems that everything they need to know or do is determined in Lansing. If I don't like it, I can just wait 6 or 8 years and they'll be gone. The problem with this solution, is that they are replaced by someone who will be no different. Do you see a pattern here? We need to break the pattern.

]]> By: John Schwark http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/#comment-307 John Schwark Sat, 13 Oct 2007 01:17:04 +0000 http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/#comment-307 Recall petitiions are a right and privilege of voting citizens. By employing the tactics of name calling and condemnation of people who disagree with decisions made by representatives of individuals who vote smacks of elitism, arrongance, and perhaps political partisanship. Using the term "partisan warfare" is a poor substitute for "political disagreement" and is indicative of one who has a political axe to grind. May I also remind you that "fringe groups" play a historical part in the development of mainstream groups and demeaning Leon Drolet in the manner you did is downright small of you. Words mean things. The words and obvious conclusions one takes from your article are not centrist in my view! Recall petitiions are a right and privilege of voting citizens. By employing the tactics of name calling and condemnation of people who disagree with decisions made by representatives of individuals who vote smacks of elitism, arrongance, and perhaps political partisanship.

Using the term "partisan warfare" is a poor substitute for "political disagreement" and is indicative of one who has a political axe to grind.

May I also remind you that "fringe groups" play a historical part in the development of mainstream groups and demeaning Leon Drolet in the manner you did is downright small of you.

Words mean things. The words and obvious conclusions one takes from your article are not centrist in my view!

]]> By: Dale Westrick http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/#comment-303 Dale Westrick Fri, 12 Oct 2007 18:30:37 +0000 http://www.thecenterformichigan.net/blog/tamp-down-recall-rage/#comment-303 I agree recalls do not solve the problem our community has done it several times. We continue to have the same mismanagement of our community resources. I used to work with a old marine and his famous saying was.(When all is said and done more is said than done) I think he got that phraze from Loe Holtz. I feel instead what they call a compensive plan we have several small plans and actually do something. Sincerly Dale Westrick. I agree recalls do not solve the problem our community has done it several times. We continue to have the same mismanagement of our community resources. I used to work with a old marine and his famous saying was.(When all is said and done more is said than done) I think he got that phraze from Loe Holtz. I feel instead what they call a compensive plan we have several small plans and actually do something. Sincerly Dale Westrick.

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