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Discussion Archive: Page 6
By The Center for Michigan - April 14, 2007
In February of 2007, we asked "How do we best transform the size and role of government, and how best to pay for it?" We received some great answers and didn't want to lose all the ideas generated when we moved into our new web site.
We've archived the posts here and we ask you to respond with your thoughts on this page.
| sandytess (guest) |
| 04/14/2007 11:00 AM |
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| How is this state ever going to attract new residents and bsinesses when U.S Representatives from the State of Michigan compare Detroit's safety with that of Baghdad? Thanks, Rep. Tim Walberg, for dimming the lights even further on the State's largest city. What happened to promotion and responsible rhetoric? How can we survive when our own elected representatives kick dirt on the grave. Does Mr. Walberg thilnk that what is bad for Detorit is good for Grand Rapids? Someone has to get this man on the same train as the rest of us or toss him out at the next stop. Sandra Tessler, Bloomfield Hills |
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| Roger Edington (guest) |
| 04/14/2007 11:02 AM |
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| Michigan should become a "Right-to-Work" state. Michigan does need to change the educational delivery system and middle colleges might help move that transformation along in a logical way to that recognition of the need for "Life Long Learning". Education must be taken out of the hands of those that want to control it and into the hands of those that want to learn forever and be measured only by what they can do and not by what pieces of meaningless papers they were able to pay for while more talented individuals are working for them. |
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Thomas Ford
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| 04/14/2007 10:40 PM |
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| I was initially pleasantly surprised to find The Center For Michigan web site. It sounded like something that the state really needed. But as I began reading the information on the site, it became clear to me that a certaln important piece of the puzzle that will put Michigan back together again was missing. This problem must be dealt with before any real progress can be made.After almost 16 years of complete Republican control of state government we are in a mess of their making. Mr. Powers lamentable "Why can't we all just get along" is just a bit too much to late. I appreciate the sentiment but when he was in control of media sources for so many years and did little or nothing to thwart politics of meanness and revenge that was so typical of the Engler years, he failed us all. Much in the same waythe media is failing us today.Now some things I think we need to do.First, we send the Obstructionist Republican leadership in the State Senate home and elect people of character who really care about Michigan. We need to reinstate the Delayed Capital Gains Tax (The Inheritance Tax) and quite possibly raise it to a higher percentage. We need to seriously look at a unicameral form of government. We need to roll back the 38% raise the legislature gave themselves back in 2000. We need serious campaign finance reform modeled on what they have done in Arizona. We need Universal Single Payer Health Care in the form offered by Rep. Conyers (Medicare For All).That would be a good start. |
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| Mike Dewey (guest) |
| 04/16/2007 10:35 AM |
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| Mr. Power,I have been reading and hearing a lot of thoughts on the state budget mess and would like to offer my solution. But first there are some things that we should not do!!! 1.) Cut funding for schools! 2.) Cut funding for law enforcement, such as the current State Trooper issue! 3.) Let the roads and infrastructure remain in the current dismal condition!! Focus needs to be maintained on issues that are important to the citizens of Michigan and of course employers that want to keep and attract talent. Education, infrastructure and public safety are close to, if not at the top of the list!
My Opinions
1.) Since the gas tax has not been raised since 1997 and inflation was ~2.6% on average for those years the gas tax should now be $0.25 per gallon. That is to make it equal to 1997 dollars. Basically it needs to be raised immediately to $0.25 per gallon from the current $0.19 and beginning in 2008 it needs to be raised to $0.30 per gallon. This will accomplish two things A.) Produce much needed state revenue and do it fairly because it is a user tax. B.) Entice drivers to use better driving habits such as stop driving so aggressively and observe the speed limits. This will more than make up for the higher price by increasing miles per gallon; Go to www.fueleconomy.gov if you do not believe me. These changes would save drivers at least the increase in the gas tax as well as make our roads much safer. Those State Troopers that are not laid off could help enforce the existing traffic laws and also bring in extra revenue with the tickets they could easily write (low hanging fruit).
2.) Temporarily raise the income tax 0.5% as was mentioned in the Sunday 4/8 Argus Press. According to the editorial this would bring in about 0.85 Billion dollars a year and get us through 2008.
3.) During that time our state leaders (including the governor) would be responsible for figuring out how to run the show without the above income tax increase. If they cannot work together and figure it out by the end of fiscal 2008 then we start docking their pay and benefits until they do, say 10% per month for a start. No party finger pointing because we will not care who is responsible because we will hold them all responsible!!!!
Mike Dewey
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John Evans
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| 04/17/2007 9:50 AM |
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| Responding to Phil Power's presentation last night at the Economic Club of Marquette County and the eight ideas for a New Model Michigan.
First I appreciated the bluntness and honesty in outlining the fiscal mess we as a state now find ourselves. We in the Upper Peninsula are sometimes insulated from the urgency of such a crises and I appreciated the proactive vision he shared to provide systemic solutions to stablizing Michigan's future. Second, I would also like to address point three of the Center for Michigan ideas concerning consolidation and service sharing ides in local governments.
My home town of Iron River, located fast on the Wisconsin border in the Western U.P. has accomplished this goal by consolidating three small communities of Iron River, Stambaugh, and Mineral Hills into one government entitiy: Iron River. It began years ago with the merger of public saftey services and ended with forward thinking leadership able to convince independent minded Yoopers that such a consolidation was in everyones self-interest. Yes, there were bumps in the road, including the renaming of duplicate streets, but the merger has at least given the area hope that brighter economic times are ahead and the sacrifices the early iron ore miners made to build those communities will be rewarded with sustainability into the future.
Might this be an example to study?
John G. Evans |
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| Rosalie King (guest) |
| 04/17/2007 8:27 PM |
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| I just heard about your organization on WLUC TV which had a speaker in Marquette last night. (04-16-07) We have had many talks on the problems off Michigan and have tried to get the "john Q public to get involved. I think our legislators have to hear from us and quit playing politics. I realize we all have various suggestions on how to solve the state's problems and it various from person to person. At a covention last year we were told that if the State Income Tax would stay as it was and not go with a reduction we would not have a problem Then comes the real problem. Who's going to get the blame? Who's going to get the credit? It's a tax increase. Someone told me a couple of years ago that the public is not going to care until they feel the crunch personally. Well, folks it safe to say we're there. No one what's their program touch but maybe we don't need the next one. I don't think local government should be expected to cut anymore as we've done our share. If loops holes were closed and taxes were spread on internet purchases we probably would't need a tax increase but until then I think we have to bite the bullet. |
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| Dan (guest) |
| 04/19/2007 2:44 PM |
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| Your call for "key political reforms" recommended by the Michigan Campaign Finance Network featured in the April 13 "Fresh Thoughts" deserves comment.Since you referenced and provided a direct link to the report of the Network, it seems reasonable to assume that The Center for Michigan generally concurs with the Network's findings and recommendations.
You've said that Michigan state government is broke. These recommendations hardly constitute fixes to a broken system. They merely tinker around the edges and, if adopted, will leave us with more of the same that we're currently experiencing.
I will comment mostly on the areas of term limits and redistricting. However, the issues of lobbying and campaign finance deserve a mention.
Until lobbying is made a capital offense, the sure solution is to constitutionally require that lobbyist or lobbying organization may not contribute to a politician or his/her campaign. Simple. If you're going to lobby a representative or senator, you can't try to buy him/her in the election campaign.
How do campaigns get financed? Again, simple. Public financing.
TERM LIMITS:
From where I sit, eliminating term limits could well be titled "Cropsey Forever". For those of you who favor elimination of term limits, I'm confident that you conjure up images of Bill Ryan and Bill Bryant reappearing with their "institutional memory". Please don't forget that you'll be back to a world of Bill Copeland, Dominic Jacobetti, Joe Mack, Gar Lane, Harold Hungerford, Andy Cobb and Carol Newton. My favorite and a tribute to institutional memmory, however, was "Fightin' Phil" Rahoi who distinguished himself in entering his explanation of a "no" vote in the House Journal with the remark that, "While I was one of the sponsors of this bill, I voted against it because I didn't know what was in it."
REDISTRICTING:
Redistricting is a problem that doesn't need to exist if we truly believed in representative government. The fact of the matter is that, at the present, we do not have representative government. Somehow, the word "competitiveness" has become the mantra that stands for perfection in a democracy. I submit that the more competitive a district is, the less representative it is.
Consider two Michigan House districts: the 27th in Oakland County and the 90th in Ottawa County. In both cases, the winners in these districts garnered 78 per cent of the votes cast. One could argue that these winners represent nearly four out of five voters. On the other hand, one out of five voters is not represented in the Michigan House of "Representatives".
By contrast, look at two other House districts which you would no doubt classify as "competitive": The 39th in Oakland County and the 84th in Huron/Tuscola Counties. In these districts, the winners got 50.2 and 51.5 per cent, respectively, of the votes in the 2006 election. This means that one-half of the voters are represented and one-half are not represented.
Similar examples exist in the case of the Michigan Senate.
Somehow, there is a disconnect between the Network's call for "competitiveness" and the need for "representativeness" in the Michigan Legislature, House and Senate. It is particularly interesting that reference should be made in the Network's report to "democracy in the Middle East". It is my understanding that particular attention has been paid to make certain that representation is given high priority in designing those budding democracies. We should be able to do that here.
So, where does this leave us? Statewide in the 2006 election, 36 per cent voted for losers in the Senate races; 34 per cent voted for losers in the House races. That means that 1.3 million voters are not represented in the Michigan Senate and 1.24 million are not represented in the Michigan House.
Predictably, more voters will be unrepresented if the goal of greater "competitiveness" is achieved. Is that what you really want?
What's the solution? Again, simple. Figure out a system in which future would-be losers are represented. It is interesting that Bernie Apol's name is invoked with reference to redistricting. I believe his (respected?) name is associated with a system of representation that would give voice to the minority of voters in a district who are not currently represented. Other approaches to representation have been advanced. Harold Norris proposed a system in the Constitutional Convention in the early '60s as did Zolton Ferency's P.A.L.P. effort in the '90s.
SUMMATION:
Redistricting essentially becomes a non-issue if an approach is achieved in which all voters are represented and the resulting elected candidates carry with them a vote in the Michigan Legislature that reflects the strength of the vote they garnered in the general election.
The Network's proposal does NOT respect minority representation. |
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| Steve (guest) |
| 04/19/2007 5:34 PM |
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| I couldn't agree more with Phil's comments. Another way to say it has always been for doers, not nay sayers, is: Necessity is the mother of invention." |
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| Steve (guest) |
| 04/19/2007 5:34 PM |
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| I couldn't agree more with Phil's comments. Another way to say it has always been for doers, not nay sayers, is: Necessity is the mother of invention." |
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| Chuck Fellows (guest) |
| 04/19/2007 5:52 PM |
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| What value, government?"Left brain is logic, right brain is creativity. We don't want our kids to compete internationally with half of their brain tied behind their backs." to quote one of your contributors. Current government is left brain, linear, sequentail and verbal with very little imagination and a rather perverse view of public service.
Yet the people of Michigan do as Mr. Power describes - and clear the road!
Following is a vote for value definition using right brain creatvity. A small tale of a business that seeks out the customers definition of the value received. Take the challenge and value this business for yourself. See what it is worth to you.
One local business I deal with returns $9.81 for every dollar invested! And it has been a consistent performer at this level of ROI for more than fifteen years.
A return of this magnitude requires cooperation and collaboration between all the components of an organization. The entity providing this financial reward is committed to supplying the benefit to its investors every day! Their employees work incredibly hard to customize their product offerings to each individual customer. Their leadership has created a culture of incremental continuous improvement that is evident in all aspects of every activity. (Certainly not the characteristics of our Legislature)
To get a snapshot of the data behind the numbers and see an assessment of VALUE, visit a small Michigan library's web page, http://salemsouthlyonlibrary.info/ and click on the link to the Library Services Calculator, http://www.ssldl.info/libcalc/.
Yes, a library, a business focused on delighting each customer and protecting the investment their taxpayers have made!
The sofware (program) is open source and could be adopted by anyone with the courage to put the definition of value in the customers hands.
And with knowledge of what the customer values maybe Michigan's government would begin to move with force and clarity - clear the damn road! |
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| RJ Percha (guest) |
| 04/19/2007 9:25 PM |
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If Jennifer would only take on some of her sacred cows, MEA, UAW, AFSCME and make some meaningful cuts/reforms which are not stop-gap measures, rather meaningful reforms in pensions, healthcare, competency testing, etc. A right-to-work state would certainly improve the chances for new business moving to Michigan
...Then, and only then, will the citizens back some form of tax increases. Band-aids will not fix the problem. Paying for college educations for people to take their skills to another state is "nutso!" |
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| ninaignaczak (guest) |
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| oberpeul (guest) |
| 05/01/2007 12:56 PM |
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| I love Michigan and am heartbroken at what I see happening. The economy is a mess, and the state of the schools is deplorable. I appreciate that the legislature needs to consider short-term, drastic measures and long-term measures. The problem is that as everyone continues to discuss the funding problem in schools--which has been looming for years due to Propasal A--most of our schools will face bancruptcy within 12- 18 months. I have no brilliant solutions. I just know that I, and many other parents, are sick of listening to what democrats or republicans are doing wrong--just work together to get the job done. Our schools must come first to keep families here, attract new businesses, and to have an educated work force in the future. |
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| Out2Trip (guest) |
| 05/01/2007 3:26 PM |
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| Never ever let the government, whether Federal, State or Local, scare you into paying more taxes!!! Raising taxes is not the answer to anything, as no country or state has ever taxed itself into prosperity. Do some research on the size of government at any level and see what those people, who are there to serve us, we the people, are making and what they are doing with our money!!! When your income drops, you have to spend less and budget your money better, buy only necessary things etc., and so should the state. But here is the difference: The politicians in Lansing can raise your taxes, giving them more money to throw away on useless programs and wasteful spending. I wish I had a checkbook that I could write checks on and spend other peoples' money and when it ran out, I could just say that they have to pay more into that checking account so I could continue to write checks on it and spend even more. Wake up people. |
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| Out2Trip (guest) |
| 05/01/2007 3:40 PM |
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| Ever notice that when tax cuts are brought up, politicians always say that the government cant afford a tax cut, but when they want to raise our taxes, has the government ever asked anyone if they could afford that tax increase??? No and they never will. When you give someone the power to spend someone else's money, they only want more of it. Once the level of tax consumers reaches 51%, that 51% will always vote to control the earnings of the 49% of tax producers. Demcorats just dont get it. Everyone says that businesses are fleeing Michigan for China or Mexico. Well most are going to tax friendly US states such as Neveda, Tennessee, Indiana, New Mexico, Wisconsin, etc. As far as the auto industry is concerned, there are more US made parts in a Toyota Camry then in a Chevy product. I blame that on the UAW. The UAW is like a lamphrey on a lake trout. They attach to it, then drain it of all bodily assets, then leave it for dead, even to their own detriment. Look what is happening to the "Big 3." Democrats and the unions have wrecked this state and made it non competitive and our canadian governor intends to keep it that way. |
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| Out2Trip (guest) |
| 05/01/2007 3:56 PM |
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| Mike Dewey: Name me one temporary tax in Michigan? If you earn less than you spend, then you have to cut your spending or go into debt. 100K to "cool cities"?, driving drug companies out of the state?, the DEQ destroying just about anybody's chance to start a new business, case in point: a guy in Escanaba wanted to start a ship yard. The DEQ put the boots to him. He said the hell with it and sold his house and property and moved to Pennsylvania and started his shipyard business. He now employs over 200 people and those arent minimum wage jobs, they are well paid jobs and they are in PA instead of the UP of Michigan. Michigan is business friendly?? Research the drug company that shut down its hq in Ann Arbor and fled the state taking with them over 2,000 jobs. Guess what?? They didnt go to a foreign country, they went to another state, imagine that. The Democrats only solution to anything is to raise taxes and make the few remaining people pay even more. |
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| Out2Trip (guest) |
| 05/01/2007 4:03 PM |
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| Could the last wage earner turn off the light when they leave Michigan, thanks. |
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| fhayek (guest) |
| 05/07/2007 11:37 AM |
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With reference to the 5/4 newsletter, the increase in taxes to 11.2% fom 10.2% is not nominal, as it represents a 10% increase in real dollars.
Michigan has to be a low tax state due to its significant natural disadvanges of climate and, not insignifantly, its position as a peninsula and as a result a more costly location for any distribution type business. We are essentially North Dakota with lakes. |
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| robo80 (guest) |
| 05/08/2007 5:23 PM |
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| We are foolish to think we can avoid raising taxes to fund our needed services and maintain a quality of life we all expect. For those anti tax fools,,here is some advice..Move to Ethiopa..no taxes ,no quality of life and no one to disagree with you,,God help is if the lunatic fringe anti tax group in Michigan gets any more attention |
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| Gufsman (guest) |
| 05/08/2007 5:28 PM |
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| As a recent retiree I received an estimated wage statement form th Office of Retirement services,Michigans Public employee retirement system. It is now two years later,I have received 1/2 of my promised retirement,been given the run around on my requests for information, and now have been told I have to resubmit all of my wage statements for the 3rd time. The office is poorly run staff is rude and uncaring and my belief in a political free retirement commission forever changed... this is a scandal |
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Have thoughts? Let us know right here!
Related PostsDiscussion Archive: Page 9
PONDERING SOLUTIONS FOR MICHIGAN'S BROKEN LEGISLATURE
Voters: Give Us Specifics and We Might Raise Taxes
Discussion Archive: Page 8
If there's one person in politics who can be depended on to raise a rumpus, it's L. Brooks Patterson
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